Saving Animals / False Gods (Migrated Thread)

[Balsa]

I finally had a chance to read Elyse's dream again and read your entire post, Balsa.  I've got some thoughts to ad but, I must confess, I probably have more questions than anything.  I'll apologize up front if I ask a question you answered later on in your post.  I read this at 3 a.m. this morning and noticed this but not sure if I made adequate notes.  In that regard, it's ok if you say you already answered.  Also, lack of sleep = a very tired me.  So, if I'm way off base on something please point it out  

One of the things that confounded me in this dream is that it seemed as if things were backwards.  In other words, what I normally interpret as positive is negative and vice versa.  In the dream there are spiders and turtles.  Both of these, to my recollection, are weavers/creators.  I seem to remember a creation myth where the earth was built on the turtles back.  But, in this dream spiders are seen as something to be feared and extinguished.  Also, the part where the chemical gets in the turtle tank is met with a flippant "I killed the spider and now worried about the turtle.  The turtle seemed ok and I thought to myself that it should be fine bit if it were to die,  that would be unfortunate. He would have to take one for the team."  This seems like, to me, killing creation which is so very opposite of every other dream I've read of Elyse.

In your analysis you mentioned, "The false god in the dream is either money or relief from money."  For some reason this sparked a memory of my own analysis of Elyse's "Space Time Continuum?" dream.  Some notes I made regarding this dream are:

The opening scene of marital discord is illustrating how far off we have gotten from our true purpose.  There is discord in our "house" (planet)

and

the fabric is frayed because humanity has looked to modern [things] (that do not last) for sustenance instead of seeking eternal life through relationship with God/fellow humans.  Note: I'm not particularly religious but I don't have any other words to describe this.  Because humanity has gone so far off track chasing money, power, greed, etc. the very fabric of our world is fraying.  We need to return to a more pure state to reweave the tapestry but (link to Rae's dream) it has to be something new because the old attempts have not worked.

Now that I'm typing this I can't seem to remember why I felt these two were connected. Maybe someone else reading this will see it. Oh, I think I figured it out!  You mentioned later on in your post about trying to determine what False God is a metaphor for.  Then you mentioned money, children abandoned, consumerism.  I think that's what jogged my memory.  The fraying of the fabric of our world, its destruction, is because of the pursuit of these things.  yea!  

In your analysis you mentioned: "In short, what I believe are the pieces to a vase puzzle were finally assembled by me only in the last few days prior to reading this very dream."  Do you feel comfortable sharing your insights?

In your analysis you mentioned that Elyse killing the spiders were her attempting to "rewrite the script to her own liking."  I'm curious about this idea.  Do you think this is possible?  If someone is strong enough?  That part of the dream sequence ended abruptly.  What would have caused it to end and/or why was the dreamer not able to complete her alteration?  Was it finished.  Was the interference enough to alter events?  Am I making sense?  

In your analysis you mentioned: "I feel the rescue story is naturally linked...." and "....perhaps road signs warning about dangerous curves ahead."  Do you think this is precognitive in the fact that it is showing an event having to do with children will precede the arrival of the false god?  If so, what do you feel the chances that the S. American refugee children are fulfilling this part of the dream?

Something I noted regarding the dream is the scene where she is on the ship and passes the rooms with belongings in them.  In this instance I see belongings as memories, or identity.  The fact that all of these accompanied the people on the ship actually supports your final analysis. I see this as total eradication of the person including the soul. What does a person leave behind when they die?- possessions and memories other people have of them.  I don't know this just seems like soul eradication to me.  Just like you mentioned, ensuring that mass death cannot be followed by mass birth = control of population.

Another thing you mentioned: "The storm is a metaphor for what can be seen coming our way, and this is the notion that you can download your mind into a machine, or a storage container of some kind in order to transcend life as a human being."  Clarification here: are you saying the download of the mind is THE event or is it an example?

Ok, that's all I've got.  Looking forward to your, and others', explanations, continued discussion.

"One of the things that confounded me in this dream is that it seemed as if things were backwards."
I saw this too as a backwards dream and had a bit of trouble to make sense out of it, but I saw it backwards for a different reason.
See if the following helps explain the backward way I saw the dream.

As the Dream began with capturing animals, then it seemed like I should begin with that first. I hadn't thought about the idea that potentially an event having to do with children could precede the arrival of the False God. What I was reasoning was that there had to be a logical answer for the many wild animals Elyse was bent upon capturing. So I thought about this and decided that the animals/children had to be without parents, and there had to be so many of them in comparison to the available adult population that most were reduced to living as wild animals. I decided the second part to the dream was an explanation of the first part. If that makes sense.

Not that I've gotten this right mind you.

Next;

" In other words, what I normally interpret as positive is negative and vice versa.  In the dream there are spiders and turtles.  Both of these, to my recollection, are weavers/creators.  I seem to remember a creation myth where the earth was built on the turtles back.  But, in this dream spiders are seen as something to be feared and extinguished.  Also, the part where the chemical gets in the turtle tank is met with a flippant "I killed the spider and now worried about the turtle.  The turtle seemed ok and I thought to myself that it should be fine bit if it were to die,  that would be unfortunate. He would have to take one for the team."  This seems like, to me, killing creation which is so very opposite of every other dream I've read of Elyse."


I hadn't seen the spider and turtle as you have. This is critical I now feel because what you say about the creatures, as forms representing creation spirits, goes directly to asking whether or not a dream, which may be depicting a future event, can be altered by changing the dream, or in this case, by killing the dream makers? I must confess I missed that entirely even though that is what I was suggesting. Yes, Universe slammed the boom down on Elyse when she decided to start re-writing the dream. So the dream was deeper than I saw or understood. You've caught how important by showing me the interaction with the creator spirits.

"In your analysis you mentioned that Elyse killing the spiders were her attempting to "rewrite the script to her own liking."  I'm curious about this idea.  Do you think this is possible?  If someone is strong enough?  That part of the dream sequence ended abruptly.  What would have caused it to end and/or why was the dreamer not able to complete her alteration?  Was it finished.  Was the interference enough to alter events?  Am I making sense?   "

Can we alter the future by altering a dream? The idea that life spawns forth from the Universe out the either and takes form in accordance with intentional thought is ancient. "Spontaneous generation or anomalous generation is an obsolete body of thought on the ordinary formation of living organisms without descent from similar organisms." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spontaneous_generation

Officially the idea is consigned to the dust bind of crack pots. Not the least of whom was apparently the legendary scientist Michael Farady.
I guess if the revisionists of science can now count Michael Faraday in as a crackpot then I will be forced to join him and wish the rest of them luck.
As without Michael Farday we would not only not be on these computers, but more likely fighting over the last drops of whale oil for the night light.

Let them say what they want, it's easy to say anything is impossible when all evidence is suppressed, ignored, denied, rewritten, and even going so
far as to steal library books in order to prevent any validations of things unwanted. They actually did this just to replace the library books with copies which altered the meaning of ground zero.  Some Russian guys have this all documented. I happened to have had a copy of one of the originals and sure enough the revised version, of which was never published by any know publishing house, was in fact actually altered with additional descriptions of what ground zero was. In the old dictionary it meant that ground zero was the point where an atomic bomb went off. In the FBI version it says it means several other related things. Now, for pete's sake...really?  So if they will go that far to merely add a couple of possible descriptions then what else wouldn't they do.

So I thought that it might be possible, but clearly I didn't understand enough. Now you come along and raise my awareness that there's more going on, and quite frankly this makes a lot of sense. Think about the nature of the tools that evil is said to require and the idea being that it too has helpers...creators as it were. So then we have the old idea of two Universes at odds which interact through people. Apparently if we could interact properly with these creator spirits then maybe the dream would continue on in a controlled manner. Maybe after enough experience you could actually call upon them for guidance and help. Maybe they too require things to create with, bug spray not being a desired one apparently.

In all seriousness, a guru will tell you much the same thing, and they can create or make objects appear out of the ethereal. They cannot sustain what they create, but for a fleeting time they are, apparently, as real as any other thing around us. From what I've been told, the TPB understand exactly what we are discussing here.  They obviously don't think this is all mumbo jumbo or else they wouldn't be so interested in what we do, as would seem to be evident from the necessity for the entire forum to be rebuilt.

Next;
"In your analysis you mentioned, "The false god in the dream is either money or relief from money."  For some reason this sparked a memory of my own analysis of Elyse's "Space Time Continuum?" dream.  Some notes I made regarding this dream are:The opening scene of marital discord is illustrating how far off we have gotten from our true purpose.  There is discord in our "house" (planet)

and

the fabric is frayed because humanity has looked to modern [things] (that do not last) for sustenance instead of seeking eternal life through relationship with God/fellow humans.  Note: I'm not particularly religious but I don't have any other words to describe this.  Because humanity has gone so far off track chasing money, power, greed, etc. the very fabric of our world is fraying.  We need to return to a more pure state to reweave the tapestry but (link to Rae's dream) it has to be something new because the old attempts have not worked.

Now that I'm typing this I can't seem to remember why I felt these two were connected. Maybe someone else reading this will see it. Oh, I think I figured it out!  You mentioned later on in your post about trying to determine what False God is a metaphor for.  Then you mentioned money, children abandoned, consumerism.  I think that's what jogged my memory.  The fraying of the fabric of our world, its destruction, is because of the pursuit of these things.  yea! "


Well this all got a bit confusing because on the one hand, the False God is a projection from a future event, but on another hand he is already here in a metaphorical sense. Our money worship being the existing False God. In order to make sense out of the dream, I imagined that a new False God would arrive in a flashy new space yacht. This is what the dream seemed to suggest, and so the new False God was taken as a representation of a physical being who will arrive here, at some future point, and who will see the false values worshiped by the people as a corruption which can be exploited. So while the False God is taken as representation of a physical being arriving in a flashy space yacht, he is also a metaphor for our present worship of Idols who are all obtainable through money; our present False God.

In other words, how do you interpret the dream: Is the False God now, is he already here? Well obviously he is, and the False God is consumerism and what better to represent that then money which buys the things that supposedly bestow God like powers upon those who have it. So the old religious God has now been replaced, and money is the de facto God, today, so he's already here metaphorically speaking. Our False God is here right now, and so what next? Since the False God is already here, the dream is saying this other False God must mean something new will arrive which will supplant the present total worship of money as the new False God.

I saw the new False God as a physical being offering gifts because that is what the dream seemed to be saying. That certainly doesn't need to be the case. The ultimate gift of God is of course everlasting life, and so any being who can seem to make this offer of everlasting life will become the new God. In that understanding we can see that a being who offers a technological promise of everlasting life will become our God. For all practical purposes though, it could be any kind of machine or device sold by a corporation which somehow offers this promise of everlasting life. So the false god doesn't have to be a physical being, but in a sense the arrival of physical being who seems to hold magical powers would make the sell job a lot easier, and so the dream actually makes quite a bit of sense in that respect.

Now the whole point of all the smoke and mirrors is to exploit the delusional ideas held by the worshipers of our present False God. I mean if you're idea is to cleanse to planet of gullible people worshiping something which is destroying the planet then you might as well make a profit off it as well. So when I read the descriptions of the piles of clothes and material objects heaped in piles aboard this flashy space yacht, then I connected that with the logic of the Nazi' in using mass murder to enrich themselves. From a corporate perspective the entire idea of being able to have people sign over everything they own and then willingly commit suicide is obviously the ultimate success by present definition of corporate success.

Another thing you mentioned: "The storm is a metaphor for what can be seen coming our way, and this is the notion that you can download your mind into a machine, or a storage container of some kind in order to transcend life as a human being."  Clarification here: are you saying the download of the mind is THE event or is it an example?

A tough question really. Do people who now worship this False God still have souls?  I don't think so. Nevertheless, it hasn't exactly resulted in a holocaust for them either... unfortunately. Therefore I expect an interdiction. A mass marketing sales job to blow your socks off. Yes, I sense that this could become an actual event. Time wise it is unclear, but if a supposedly advanced being claiming to grant God like gifts arrived tomorrow do you yourself think they would be ignored?  So yes, people will actually and willingly follow the False God in pursuit of their own False Gods to their doom, or everlasting hell as the case may be since without your brain you're not going to be returning back for further adventures.

Here you make an astounding observation I think.

"Something I noted regarding the dream is the scene where she is on the ship and passes the rooms with belongings in them.  In this instance I see belongings as memories, or identity.  The fact that all of these accompanied the people on the ship actually supports your final analysis. I see this as total eradication of the person including the soul. What does a person leave behind when they die?- possessions and memories other people have of them.  I don't know this just seems like soul eradication to me.  Just like you mentioned, ensuring that mass death cannot be followed by mass birth = control of population."

Yes you are correct. It is soul eradication. If consciousness comes from time and sustains itself in a field either in or out of the body, most likely both, and if it is then moved to an artificial device, then how reasonable is it to expect to re-enter another body which is already occupied, and you're not going to be reanimating your old one because it's a sure bet that old thing was incinerated or ground up to make fertilizer?  So it's probably not very likely is it?  People won't be thinking these kinds of things because that's just a bunch of witch doctor mumbo jumbo, and that's what our so-called science is telling them right now.

It was once believed that when a computer could answer a person, without a person knowing it was a computer, then we would have arrived at artificial intelligence. That was the Turing Test, named after Alan Turning. IBM proved that idea was wrong back in the 1970's. The point being, how would anyone ever know if someone had actually and successfully transferred their mind to a machine?  It's impossible, so it's gonna be another lie they follow along with. It's like a Pied Piper kind of mentality and we see this around ourselves all the time. Group think is a primary objective behind mass media and public indoctrination systems.

So that's what I was seeing when I read that dream. People essentially so alienated from reality and life that they already basically the walking dead. In this way it helps to also explain why Elyse couldn't stop her own son from going with the False God. In the dream her son is already zombified by the unattainable offering the False God sells. Yes, I know I argued for physiological interdiction such as a electormagnetic field which might be messing with her motor functions, but it's just as easy to see that the lure of the False Gods promise is so great that you can't stop anyone who's fallen under the illusion offered by this false.  I've been through this several times now in a different way, trying to get zombified people to not do something the new clowns were telling them was a good idea. After all, who am I but some old looser anyways?  I know lots of people have been encountering this in different ways and can probably relate to that part of the story, about feeling helpless and unable to change them or hold them back.

OK...well didn't mean to write another book, but sometimes there's no way around it.